LAPD DETECTIVES CONTINUE CROSS: Danny Masterson Trial, Day 17, afternoon break report
[This report was produced live during a court hearing with a lot going on. There will be typos. Please don't email us about typos that you find.]
After lunch session.
The jury will be coming back this afternoon. The Masterson section is fairly full: Mom, Christopher, and Jordan. Bijou, Mackenzie, and Chynna. Chris Wadhams. And family friend Graham Bruwer in the general audience section.
Oh no, it looks like the prosecution is setting up to play an audiotape. Spare us.
Det Javier Vargas is back on the witness stand.
Continuing cross by Philip Cohen.
Cohen: Since we broke have you taken the opportunity to view any of the transcripts we spoke about?
I think the last time we were here, the judge recommended hearing the audio recordings.
You understood you were coming back to answer more questions.
And you had answered questions about the report versus the transcripts.
Do you have a copy of the transcripts at this point?
I do not.
Have you spoken to Mueller or Anson substantively about this case?
We left off with your interview of Jane Doe 3. She had spoken with you and DA Mueller... (Puts up a document, list of interview dates.) I was asking about the 6-1-17 interview with JD3 and Mueller.
You were aware that JD3 had already given an extensive interview to Det Reyes.
She talked about the dynamic of her relationship of Masterson, that he wanted a lot of sex and she didn't want to have as much.
And she said because of this, she came up with a number of verbal excuses to try to avoid sex.
I don't recall verbal excuses.
Do you recall her saying she was too tired.
I believe so.
That she would say she had an audition in the morning.
That sounds familiar.
That she had to take classes the next day.
I don't recall.
Do you recall her indicating after a million times saying these things, most of the time "I ended up just giving in." (Obj, overruled)
I believe her statement was I gave in because she didn't want to fight with him.
Do recall the statement that I asked you about? "Most of the time I ended up just giving in."
Not specifically, but it sounds familiar.
Would it refresh your recollection to look at your report?
No, I'd rather look at the transcript of that part.
Is that statement in your report?
I don't believe it is, not verbatim. Not word for word.
(Gives him transcript of interview) Did she talk about a million times giving various reasons?
Those are her words, verbatim, yes.
She told you that Masterson had never threatened that he would hurt her, correct?
And as you just indicated or clarified, those were her words, right?
JD3 said that when she refused or didn't have sex, that he would get angry and go away. Right?
On which occasion?
Seems like on almost all occasions.
I don't recall.
Do you remember when she refused, he would spend a day or two ignoring her?
That sounds right.
Is that in your report?
I don't believe I included the ignoring part.
But that sounds right?
There was, during this interview, a discussion of the Dec 2001 sodomy or anal rape, correct?
And then towards the end, a discussion about the allegation in this case, is that right?
I believe that's the same case.
You believe the allegation in this case, is the December 2001 unconscious sodomy, is that right?
Counsel, you're right, there are two incidents, but the charge in this case is the unconscious sodomy.
By the way, did JD3 indicate that she had signed a document with respect to Masterson wherein she indicated she would not sue him for what's called palimony? (Obj, sustained. Rephrase) Did she indicate that she signed a paper saying she wouldn't sue for palimony? (Obj, Olmedo calls for sidebar.)
Well, Det Vargas is confused and is saying the charged allegation is the December unconscious sodomy, when the charge is actually for the November hair-pulling incident. But he's not the DA and did not actually file the charges, after all.
Cohen: Did JD3 indicate that she had signed a piece of paper where she agreed not to sue Masterson for palimony.
Do you recall an interview you conducted with Jane Doe 2's mother?
And you were here when she testified?
Did she indicate in her interview that you wanted her independent recollection of things without any outside influence?
And that was true?
And fair to say the reason you want that is so that you get what they remember and not what other people may have told them.
And that request, that you want an independent recollection, that's true for any witness.
True for a witness, named victim, third party, whatever witness you speak with, you want their recollection without outside influences.
True, you want to know what they heard, what they saw.
When you refer to outside influences, can be another witness? (Obj, sustained) Well, you learned that JD2's mother had spoken to JD2 the night before you interviewed her, correct?
And under that scenario, JD2 could be considered an outside influence?
She told me that she would be contacting her mother to let her know I was calling.
Do you know what was said on that phone call?
Could an outside influence also be a police officer? (Obj, sustained) When you spoke with Jane Doe 2, did you ask her about other people that she had told about the Masterson incident?
During that interview, did Jane Doe 2 ever tell you that she had told a [Jane Doe 4]?
I recall having a conversation with [Jane Doe 4].
My question is, during your interview, when Jane Doe 2 was asked who she had told, during that interview did she mention a Jane Doe 4?
I don't recall when exactly it was mentioned.
Would it refresh your recollection to look at a report?
Yes. (He checks his report.) OK.
Did she ever mention JD4 during May 2017 interview?
In fact she didn't mention JD4 until 2019.
In the May 2017 interview with Jane Doe 2, she never made any mention of Rachel Smith?
No further questions.
Mueller: You were asked whether Jane Doe 2 had ever indicated to you that Masterson had texted her or said, if you do not come over here I am going to come and get you. Do you recall being asked that?
And you don't believe you documented that.
And you also said you don't recollect her saying that.
If I showed you a transcript of the interview you and I conducted would it refresh your memory?
Yes. (Checks.) OK.
During the interview we had with her, did she tell you about such a text?
What was that statement.
If she didn't go over he would go and get her.
With regard to JD2, her being OK with Masterson fingering her at different times. Prior to the shower, do you recall her actually saying she was OK with that?
No. Not prior.
In fact, at the time that JD2 had given the statement about being in the jacuzzi, did she ever say she was OK with him fingering her?
I don't recall.
If I direct you to the transcript, would that refresh your recollection?
Yes. (Checks.) OK.
During that interview did JD2 ever say she was OK with him fingering her in the jacuzzi?
No. She was only OK with kissing.
Did she even say there was any fingering in the jacuzzi?
She did not.
Did JD2 tell you in that interview how she was feeling at that point of time, physically?
I don't remember how she felt. (Judge Olmedo admonishes Mueller to go to areas not already asked and answered.) With Masterson asking JD2 to go into his room, you mentioned that you were mistaken in your report.
What was it you thought she had said about that?
Before going upstairs to the shower he had ordered her to go up there.
Do you recall her telling you at the time of the interview?
No. (Shows him transcript.) OK.
What was it she told you in regard to ending up in his bedroom.
On two different occasions, he told her to go to his room.
You were asked today about JD3 that she had said no a million times and then just gave in. The interview with her, that was essentially an interview... (Rephrase). This was a general interview over the six-year relationship.
And did she describe various things that had happened over that time?
And were there times she said no and then just gave in.
Were there times she said no and got into a fight.
And at some point did she talk about an incident she recalled from 2001?
Yes. I just don't recall the exact month.
Are you aware that there were two incidents she described in 2001?
You're familiar with the December 2001 that is being referred to as the sodomy incident?
You're familiar with an incident prior to that?
Was JD3 asked about if there was ever a time where force was involved with sex with Mr. Masterson? (Obj asked and answered, overruled)
And this is during this interview with her?
Do you recall what her response was?
Yes. I recall there was a situation where he got on top of her, she pulled his hair because she was careful not to strike his face, and he retaliated against her by, I think, pulling her hair and dragging her off the bed.
Did she talk to you about the time when she was on the bed and woke up and he was on top of her? (Obj, overruled)
Yes. I don't recall the specifics.
Do you recall JD3 being asked if there was any time in the relationship when she had said she didn't want sex, and he had used force to do it anyway?
What was her response to that question?
I don't recall the exact specifics. (Shows him a transcript.) (Olmedo calls for sidebar.) OK
So as far as a time when force was used with six.
She stated there were multiple times.
With regard to whether there were times he does not want to have sex and he had ignored that request and had engaged in sex with force, what did she say?
She said there was a time when he was on top of her, naked, she tried to push him away, he hit her, and entered her.
And as far as other times of sex with force?
No further questions.
Cohen: JD2 had indicated to you that Masterson had "asked" her to go into the room. (Asked and answered. Sustained. Sidebar.) I just want to be clear on one point. JD2 indicated to you and Mueller, that Masterson had "asked" her to go into the bedroom. (Obj, rephrase). In your report you had indicated that he had ordered her.
But she said he asked.
Actually both. The overwhelming word was "told" her. She said many times he ordered her.
But when she said he "asked" her, why didn't you ask her why she used the word asked?
I didn't ask.
Do you have a rooting interest in this case? (Obj, sustained) JD3, does she ever mention the month November 2001 in your report?
I don't recall.
Would it help to look at your report?
Sure. (Checks.) (Getting the distinct feeling Judge Olmedo is getting frustrated with both sides. This is taking too long, and these seem like pretty minor points.)
Does your report ever mention November 2001?
Not in that report.
In your transcript of your interview, does JD3 ever mention November 2001?
I'm not sure.
Is that something that would have made it into your report?
I think so.
So can we take from the fact that it's not in your report, that she did not mention November 2001 in the interview? (Obj, sustained). DA Mueller had asked JD3 that beside pulling his hair, in terms of doing anything else, did she? Let me rephrase that. Do you recall DA Mueller ask if she had used any other force besides pulling hair, and said she didn't know for sure and she didn't want to say anything she didn't know for sure?
I know she was confused at times about her memory...
Det Vargas, I'm loathe to interrupt a witness but did she say that?
I don't remember.
Would it help to look at a transcript?
Yes. (Checks) OK
By the way, do you have an independent recollection of this interview?
Do you recall DA Mueller asking if she tried something other than pulling his hair?
And she said I can't be sure. I don't want to say anything I don't know for sure?
I asked you the other day about her statement I can't give you much about that night. Do you recall her indicated that? (Asked and answered.) It was asked, but not answered.
Would it be fair to say JD3 never made any statement about Masterson holding her arms down, or holding his elbow down on her in the interview?
Do you recall Mueller asking, do you remember him holding you, and she said, he was on top of me?
Mueller: When JD3 said about pulling his hair, did she also say about trying to push him off?
She did. She tried to push him off but she couldn't.
Det Vargas is done.
We're taking a few minutes to prepare for Det Reyes to come back in.
Det Esther Reyes (Myape) on the stand. Jury back in.
Continuing cross-examination of Det Reyes.
Cohen: We're going to pick up in middle of cross. Did you see Det Vargas when he left?
Did you see Det Vargas?
Did you talk to him at all?
Did you review the interviews of the three Jane Does in preparation for today?
When you spoke to JD1, she made a comment to you with respect to the Sept 2002 incident, where she indicated, "alcohol does stuff to you."
I vaguely remember that.
I don't want you to guess. Did she say that?
If I could look at the transcript. (Cohen pulls one up.)
Did she make that statement?
With respect to the issue of bruising, you and JD1 spoke quite a bit about her description of bruises on her body once she left for Florida.
And she indicated to you that the bruises were coming through like crazy, is that right?
She indicated the bruises, I don't remember the word "crazy."
Do you remember her saying I had bruises everywhere.
I remember her saying she had bruises on her neck and her arms.
Would it help to refresh your recollection... (brings her a document). With respect to her saying bruises coming through like "crazy" and to bruises "everywhere." Did she indicate that?
Did she indicate that when she got to Florida she called Mr. Masterson to try to find out what had happened?
That I don't recall.
Do you recall that she said she called him and said I don't know why I hurt and I'm covered with bruises, and Masterson laughing?
That does sound familiar, him laughing at her.
What about the part leading up to that?
If I could refresh my recollection. (Asks her to look for both "what happened" and Masterson saying "we had sex.")
Does that help?
Did she indicate that when she got to Florida she called Masterson because, as she put it, I don't know what the fuck happened. So she called, what happened, and he laughed and (Obj reading, sustained) Do you recall her getting to Florida and not remembering what the fuck happened?
And that she called him?
And she said he said I take it you don't remember?
And she said he said we had sex.
And she said she said no, no, you're lying. Is that what she told you about this phone call?
Did she tell you that she woke up at 3 pm in the afternoon with her and Masterson in the bed together?
I don't recall that.
Did she tell you she then talked with him about what to say to Luke Watson?
I don't recall that.
What she told you is that the first time she learned that she had had sex was when she was in Florida and called him on the phone.
Second thing I was going to ask you to recollect is the thing about her having bruises all over and not sure how they got there. Did she say that to you?
Did she indicated to you that she had left a voicemail message for her dad, asking for help at the top of the stairs?
Have you ever seen or heard a voicemail that she described?
You also sat in an interview with JD3. Did you ask her leading questions, in terms of trying to get her give you certain information?
I asked her to tell a story. I asked her to tell me what happened. I wouldn't characterize my questions as leading.
Do you recall asking, with respect to Masterson, he would force himself on you until you gave in. Isn't that a leading question?
I don't think so.
Do you recall her answer?
I recall he agreeing.
To what I asked her.
He would force himself on you until you said OK, or he would just do it. And she would say, he would force himself and I would just let him do it.
Did you ask her that, "let him do it but you always said no"
Do you remember her answer?
Did she say, "Not always."
That sounds familiar.
Do you recall talking to JD3 what had caused her not to want sex anymore with him?
Do you recall her saying that "I just felt it was never sweet or romantic" (Obj, sustained) Do you remember her telling you why she had stopped?
Would it help to look at the transcript?
Do you now recall what she said made her want to stop having sex?
That it was never sweet, never romantic?
And you asked never loving, never caring? (Obj, sustained) Do you recall her answer?
What was it?
During your interview with JD3, the month of November 2001 is never mentioned?
Did she ever tell you that Masterson had hit her with a closed fist?
I don't recall that.
Did she ever tell you that he hit her with an open fist?
You mean like a slap?
I’m not sure what an open fist is, but we've heard those words. Do you remember hearing that?
She told you that when she had pulled his hair, he had slapped her, correct?
And that was JD3's indication, that he had slapped her, correct?
Do you know how that conversation played out? (Obj, sustained) Do you remember the interplay between the two of you about his hitting her?
Judge Olmedo calls for the afternoon break.
Thank you for reading today’s story here at Substack. For the full picture of what’s happening today in the world of Scientology, please join the conversation at tonyortega.org, where we’ve been reporting daily on David Miscavige’s cabal since 2012. There you’ll find additional stories, and our popular regular daily features:
Source Code: Actual things founder L. Ron Hubbard said on this date in history
Avast, Ye Mateys: Snapshots from Scientology’s years at sea
Overheard in the Freezone: Indie Hubbardism, one thought at a time
Past is Prologue: From this week in history at alt.religion.scientology
Random Howdy: Your daily dose of the Captain
Here’s the link for today’s post at tonyortega.org
And whatever you do, subscribe to this Substack so you get our breaking stories and daily features right to your email inbox every morning…
I don’t understand why Cohen asked about whether JD3 said she was slapped or hit with an open fist. If I were a juror I would be wondering what difference it makes. She said he hit her. If Cohen was trying to show that JD3’s story had changed, in my opinion he failed miserably.
I thought they'd both basically testified to the same things the other day, or pretty darn close. As a non lawyer, I don't understand the point of repeating it, unless it's to drive certain ideas home in the minds of the jurors. What those ideas might be, I can't fathom. It seemed like a waste of time.
Thanks for report!!