Back in December, Scientology leader David Miscavige stunned us by having the church submit an “amicus” brief on behalf of convicted serial rapist Danny Masterson, trying to sway the justices weighing Masterson’s appeal and get the That ‘70s Show actor released from prison.
How much did Miscavige 'donate' to those varied 'religious' groups to get those amicus? Without looking at all of them, I bet that they all follow the same thread of 'they're picking on us' that Miscavige spouts.
As for the International Society for Krishna Consciousness, get into a full lotus position and tell the court where your flower sales have gone down. I suspect that they were the bargain basement of the payoffs.
These groups seem to be very weak entities to be used as examples to listen to in this case. No actual religion heads speaking up in Masterson’s defense, just a bunch of periphery or ultra low rung groups that don’t and cannot speak for their entire religion. The Queens Federation of Churches (http://queenschurches.org/) for example, their website is the most basic, “older than rocks on the beach, it’s a website because we need a website not because anyone uses it” website. Their copyright notice at the bottom is a year and a half out of date, so they haven’t updated their site in at least that long.
I’m not saying someone has to have a huge presence online to be able to be counted as a religious group or a peripheral one as is likely the case with all these groups, but I’ll bet almost all of these groups have next to zero presence online and barely any footprint in the real world. Them being mentioned by a larger group like Scientology is getting them attention by association which is likely the only reason they put their name to this. No one would be talking about The Queens Federation of Churches this week unless Scientology dragged them along for the ride.
It would be like being a McDonald’s franchise owner who gets into legal trouble, and to try to help, McDonald’s goes around and gets statements from Burger King, Wendy’s and Taco Bell franchise owners, not the CEO’s at the top, not the executives who run things at a nation size level, but just a random franchise owner from a thousand miles away, as if that has any bearing on what has happened at all.
I’ll be amicable, and I’ll be brief, this will almost certainly go the way of the other recent Amicus Brief, it will be accepted to appease the people submitting it, and then it will be ignored.
Edit: I said I’d be brief, oh well. The Puerto Rico blurb says this guy in the photo is doing his Survival Rundown for the second time. Why? If Scientology works, why would you ever have to do any part of it again that you already completed? It should be stored up there in your supercomputer brain, no? The mere fact that they even offer to have people do these things again screams that Scientology doesn’t work. If it did, you’d never have to do anything twice. Once you passed something, you should have it up there with perfect recall, the programming set in place like code on a hard drive. If you install a program on a computer, unless something has gone very wrong with the install or the computer after the fact, you won’t have to reinstall the software. It’s just there.
The question really becomes, if Scientology is so awesome, why are so many people having to redo these courses over and over again? The real answer is that Scientology are doubling dipping to get at least some form of revenue coming in at these Orgs. No doubt they’re all questioning each other relentlessly trying to find which course or courses someone didn’t feel 100% confident in when they did it, and as soon as they find out someone had even a 1% crack in that confidence in it, they’ll start haranguing that person to do the course again. All side-eyeing each other to watch out for moments and opportunities for when they can get someone to dump more of their money into the failing Org.
They’re getting so desperate that they taking actions that do nothing but overtly SCREAM OUT LOUD that they’re in dire straits when it comes to membership. We’ve seen more news about existing people retaking courses than we have new people joining.
Ok I’m done waffling, time to go kick Monday in the balls.
Fairly stinks of OSA. How they weaseled their way into these fairly marginal groups will be a story some day, if we can ever uncover it.
Of course no religion likes the idea that their rituals or covenants can be used to bolster a case against a parishioner. Go down that road, and soon we will be prosecuting mercy killings or something. OMG, Warren Jeffs!
But that's not what happened here, and the real religious power players know it. First off, they all know Scientology's claim to religiosity is somewhere south of the Church of Satan. At least satanism has some sincere beliefs. Scientology is just cribbed from the OTO (Aleister Crowley's Ordo Templi Orientis). What of their claim to be based on science? If it's all science there's no faith involved! Can't have it both ways.
Second, the prosecution did not use the pseudo-religious Scientology teachings against Donkey-Punch. Just pointed out that the merciless mercenary bureaucracy of the organization protected him by delaying the Jane Does' appeal to the legal system. How this amounts to an attack on religion is quite a stretch.
Oh well, logic and reason are not Dave's strong points. If it fools the court, all is well for Dave. If not, he has lots of other tricks up his sleeve.
Replying to your edit. It is completely insane that they are repeating the Survival Rundown. In theory, you are not supposed to repeat things. Done is done, except for a very few things like the Purification Rundown (oops, gotta sweat out that reefer) and the Cause Resurgence Rundown. Can't ever run around that pole too many times.
But very often they will claim that an error was made, so you gotta do another go-round. At your own expense, of course. Being a Scientologist means you never have to say you're sorry.
The Survival Rundown is special, in that it really can't be completed if you take Hubbard literally. You are supposed to leave your body on every process. You have to lie to get it to stop. Even when you sort of know that deep down it is so horrifically repetitious that you end up lying about it just to get it to stop. Leaving open the possibility that someone will talk you into repeating it. This time for sure!
They are also stuck with these odd side branches of the Bridge because the main Bridge is out. Nothing beyond OT VIII will ever be available. Those who have "done the Bridge" need something to keep them in the game, so we get these side issues like Cause Resurgence and Survival Rundown.
Doesn’t take much research to see the “religious groups” are tiny organizations. Once again Scientology uses “positioning policies” to look legitimate.
Looks good on paper. BS. Here’s an example of one of the groups.
—The LA Interfaith Clergy Coalition is an ecumenical and interfaith cooperative network that unites Los Angeles faith leaders to address social justice, community programming, and emergency preparedness. The organization has historically collaborated with local groups like the Church of Scientology and the American Red Cross to boost community resilience
Scientology's reputation is only official Scientology's fault.
a-0) Remove Miscavige. Retire him quietly.
a) reform/cease disconnection for real (implement only "handle" on PTS handlings, except in RARE cases)
b) amnesty all past SP declares
c) lower prices
d) pay staffs greater allowances
e) disband OSA, save all that money wasted on lawyers and PIs
f) downsize staff (and pay helping staff move back to regular life)
g) pay off humanely (have outsider genuine religion allies be the ones, and pay outsiders, to be on committees and decide) all persons Scientology's messed up their lives
h) use way to happiness "virtues" from Precept 20 to reform ALL of Hubbard's backfiring regulations top to bottom, which just means do basically like splinter Scientology, who just drop all the "High Crimes" "SP" regulations to blame each other and blame the public.
Until Scientology does the major points above, then Scientology deserves it's negative reputation.
Agreed. So constant defining Hubbard's spiritualism in terms of Xenu and ghosts and exorcism OT 3, 4, 5, 6 and 7 steps, those details, I can tell average people, so even if media can't stick on a quick definition of what Scientology practices are, which when told to someone, I do it almost daily (I have 6 Tshirts saying "Xenu caused the Wall of Fire" and in 2 minutes I can explain Scientology, and "ruin" people from being allowed to do Scientology, LOL, at least ruin them from official Scientology).
Telling people the OT 3 to OT 7 band of steps, in spiritualism language, ghosts language, Wall of Fire and Xenu explained, and this is Scientology's spiritualism relief goal, I get thanked over and over, for simplifying it down to spiritualism and massive ghosts exorcism that goes on for years, LOL.
Everyone loves to hear simply explained the Xenu body-thetans/ghosts exorcism steps and that Tom Cruise had done all his exorcism. Scientology's trying to free earth of a whole lotta messed up ghosts. Ghost-freers, not ghost busters.
yea, so right you are, it's spiritualism quackery, Xenu's ghosts "freeing" is done in such massive quantities, and followers just beaten over their heads to "stay on the Bridge" and get all the exorcism done.
I thought DIY will always be possible, if the whole official movement collapses.
People could dig up on the internet the quackery spiritualism exorcism and DIY but not force it on one another, I wouldn't do that, but it's an options for people into spiritualism.
The splinter Scientologists I don't think force each other. They do the quackery because they think it is of benefit, and they've dispensed with the Hubbard forcing penalty beating their followers over their heads stuff.
Simplying, I today in my daily life, I can dumb Scientology down to spiritualism comparison and "freeing" the ghosts off one's human body, and mention that Tom Cruise has free all his infesting ghosts, and people I explain Scientology thank me, since no one tells them what the durned practice is.
People innately, the ones I run into, know not to get involved with it. I don't warn them so much on the totalitarianism fanaticism, I like to spell out the beliefs, since that's what I wished was in the library when I foolishly joined in 1975, they didn't explain the ghosts exorcism, I wish was out then. I didn't realize Scientology's just a massive high volume spiritualism supposed alleviation practice at the top end, OT 3, 4, 5, 6 and 7 today.
I don't want to see Scientology reformed as you're suggesting. I want to see it eliminated. It's nothing more than a mind controlling and money-making cult. It would be like trying to reform organized crime. Scientology's been described in Wikipedia as a 'religious mafia' which is an accurate description.
I do think "reforming" it is the right direction. That's the intuitive direction of how the splinter Scientologists have gone, over the decades, which is dump all the fanatical excessive Hubbard SP penalties and totalitarian regulations.
Should one never do Scientology, yes, I'd say never do it. Should one quit it, I'd say yes, quit it.
I today, even today, running into people hiking, I define Scientology in 30 seconds. I explain OT 3, 4, 5, 6 and 7 and people thank me for explaining what the media never does focus on, which is the massive science fiction spiritualism activities of Scientology followers. (I wear my "Xenu caused the Wall of Fire" Tshirts all the time, and then I just explain my Tshirt to them.)
Hubbard never dumbed his spiritualism practices down simply, and the followers are incapable and not allowed to dumb Hubbard's science fictionesque spiritualism massive high volume exorcism of Xenu's ghosts that Hubbard teaches is humanity's problem, which to everyday people it's so obvious the Hubbard spiritualism is not what's wrong with earth.
Sure, karma, but then, why punish anyone, even those deserving, honestly, if punishment therapy for ex Scientology bad leaders, yea the thought of sending them to their own "holes" they created to punish others, seems tit for tat.
"The Truth Rundown" which I'm glad is a product purchasable and the Anderson Cooper TV shows on the violence at the top of Scientology.
Scientology ought but is incapable of getting Miscavige off the thrown.
After all I've read here and heard on YT, I truly feel Missavage should be dished his own discipline. He doesn't deserve forgiveness for what he's done and continues to do. That's my opinion and I'm sticking to it!
So Dave couldn’t find any Wal Mart level religious groups to willing to support Masterson and he was able to convince a few dollar store level groups to flex their muscle. I sincerely hope this brief gets exactly the reading it deserves.
If Masterson wasn't financially affluent, would David Miscavige be making any effort to have him released from prison? I'm sure it's all about the money that Masterson would be donating to Scientology if he hadn't been sent to prison. This is why the Church of Scientology is a church in name only and why Scientology is a religion in name only.
I don’t think he cares if Danny gets out. He’s just trying to make Scientology look better. And if releasing a serial rapist helps rehab Scientology he will take it. Yes, even writing this sentence is insane. Miscavige lives that insanity.
There's nothing Miscavige can do to make Scientology look better. It's always had a very bad reputation. When I was involved back in the 80s, I would hear members talking about avoiding bad PR when Scientology had nothing but bad PR. So many members were blind to reality. They bought LRH's propaganda that anyone attacking Scientology is suppressive and doesn't want people to get better.
I was in the GO in the 70s. It doesn’t matter if Scientology’s image can be improved. The entire purpose is to make those still in the bubble still believe it is wonderful.
How much did Miscavige 'donate' to those varied 'religious' groups to get those amicus? Without looking at all of them, I bet that they all follow the same thread of 'they're picking on us' that Miscavige spouts.
As for the International Society for Krishna Consciousness, get into a full lotus position and tell the court where your flower sales have gone down. I suspect that they were the bargain basement of the payoffs.
These groups seem to be very weak entities to be used as examples to listen to in this case. No actual religion heads speaking up in Masterson’s defense, just a bunch of periphery or ultra low rung groups that don’t and cannot speak for their entire religion. The Queens Federation of Churches (http://queenschurches.org/) for example, their website is the most basic, “older than rocks on the beach, it’s a website because we need a website not because anyone uses it” website. Their copyright notice at the bottom is a year and a half out of date, so they haven’t updated their site in at least that long.
I’m not saying someone has to have a huge presence online to be able to be counted as a religious group or a peripheral one as is likely the case with all these groups, but I’ll bet almost all of these groups have next to zero presence online and barely any footprint in the real world. Them being mentioned by a larger group like Scientology is getting them attention by association which is likely the only reason they put their name to this. No one would be talking about The Queens Federation of Churches this week unless Scientology dragged them along for the ride.
It would be like being a McDonald’s franchise owner who gets into legal trouble, and to try to help, McDonald’s goes around and gets statements from Burger King, Wendy’s and Taco Bell franchise owners, not the CEO’s at the top, not the executives who run things at a nation size level, but just a random franchise owner from a thousand miles away, as if that has any bearing on what has happened at all.
I’ll be amicable, and I’ll be brief, this will almost certainly go the way of the other recent Amicus Brief, it will be accepted to appease the people submitting it, and then it will be ignored.
Edit: I said I’d be brief, oh well. The Puerto Rico blurb says this guy in the photo is doing his Survival Rundown for the second time. Why? If Scientology works, why would you ever have to do any part of it again that you already completed? It should be stored up there in your supercomputer brain, no? The mere fact that they even offer to have people do these things again screams that Scientology doesn’t work. If it did, you’d never have to do anything twice. Once you passed something, you should have it up there with perfect recall, the programming set in place like code on a hard drive. If you install a program on a computer, unless something has gone very wrong with the install or the computer after the fact, you won’t have to reinstall the software. It’s just there.
The question really becomes, if Scientology is so awesome, why are so many people having to redo these courses over and over again? The real answer is that Scientology are doubling dipping to get at least some form of revenue coming in at these Orgs. No doubt they’re all questioning each other relentlessly trying to find which course or courses someone didn’t feel 100% confident in when they did it, and as soon as they find out someone had even a 1% crack in that confidence in it, they’ll start haranguing that person to do the course again. All side-eyeing each other to watch out for moments and opportunities for when they can get someone to dump more of their money into the failing Org.
They’re getting so desperate that they taking actions that do nothing but overtly SCREAM OUT LOUD that they’re in dire straits when it comes to membership. We’ve seen more news about existing people retaking courses than we have new people joining.
Ok I’m done waffling, time to go kick Monday in the balls.
Fairly stinks of OSA. How they weaseled their way into these fairly marginal groups will be a story some day, if we can ever uncover it.
Of course no religion likes the idea that their rituals or covenants can be used to bolster a case against a parishioner. Go down that road, and soon we will be prosecuting mercy killings or something. OMG, Warren Jeffs!
But that's not what happened here, and the real religious power players know it. First off, they all know Scientology's claim to religiosity is somewhere south of the Church of Satan. At least satanism has some sincere beliefs. Scientology is just cribbed from the OTO (Aleister Crowley's Ordo Templi Orientis). What of their claim to be based on science? If it's all science there's no faith involved! Can't have it both ways.
Second, the prosecution did not use the pseudo-religious Scientology teachings against Donkey-Punch. Just pointed out that the merciless mercenary bureaucracy of the organization protected him by delaying the Jane Does' appeal to the legal system. How this amounts to an attack on religion is quite a stretch.
Oh well, logic and reason are not Dave's strong points. If it fools the court, all is well for Dave. If not, he has lots of other tricks up his sleeve.
Replying to your edit. It is completely insane that they are repeating the Survival Rundown. In theory, you are not supposed to repeat things. Done is done, except for a very few things like the Purification Rundown (oops, gotta sweat out that reefer) and the Cause Resurgence Rundown. Can't ever run around that pole too many times.
But very often they will claim that an error was made, so you gotta do another go-round. At your own expense, of course. Being a Scientologist means you never have to say you're sorry.
The Survival Rundown is special, in that it really can't be completed if you take Hubbard literally. You are supposed to leave your body on every process. You have to lie to get it to stop. Even when you sort of know that deep down it is so horrifically repetitious that you end up lying about it just to get it to stop. Leaving open the possibility that someone will talk you into repeating it. This time for sure!
They are also stuck with these odd side branches of the Bridge because the main Bridge is out. Nothing beyond OT VIII will ever be available. Those who have "done the Bridge" need something to keep them in the game, so we get these side issues like Cause Resurgence and Survival Rundown.
Doesn’t take much research to see the “religious groups” are tiny organizations. Once again Scientology uses “positioning policies” to look legitimate.
Looks good on paper. BS. Here’s an example of one of the groups.
—The LA Interfaith Clergy Coalition is an ecumenical and interfaith cooperative network that unites Los Angeles faith leaders to address social justice, community programming, and emergency preparedness. The organization has historically collaborated with local groups like the Church of Scientology and the American Red Cross to boost community resilience
https://www.facebook.com/LAInterfaithClergyCoalition/
Scientology's reputation is only official Scientology's fault.
a-0) Remove Miscavige. Retire him quietly.
a) reform/cease disconnection for real (implement only "handle" on PTS handlings, except in RARE cases)
b) amnesty all past SP declares
c) lower prices
d) pay staffs greater allowances
e) disband OSA, save all that money wasted on lawyers and PIs
f) downsize staff (and pay helping staff move back to regular life)
g) pay off humanely (have outsider genuine religion allies be the ones, and pay outsiders, to be on committees and decide) all persons Scientology's messed up their lives
h) use way to happiness "virtues" from Precept 20 to reform ALL of Hubbard's backfiring regulations top to bottom, which just means do basically like splinter Scientology, who just drop all the "High Crimes" "SP" regulations to blame each other and blame the public.
Until Scientology does the major points above, then Scientology deserves it's negative reputation.
That doesn’t handle the problem that Scientology training and processing is quackery and actually causes mental damage to the people forced to do it.
Agreed. So constant defining Hubbard's spiritualism in terms of Xenu and ghosts and exorcism OT 3, 4, 5, 6 and 7 steps, those details, I can tell average people, so even if media can't stick on a quick definition of what Scientology practices are, which when told to someone, I do it almost daily (I have 6 Tshirts saying "Xenu caused the Wall of Fire" and in 2 minutes I can explain Scientology, and "ruin" people from being allowed to do Scientology, LOL, at least ruin them from official Scientology).
Telling people the OT 3 to OT 7 band of steps, in spiritualism language, ghosts language, Wall of Fire and Xenu explained, and this is Scientology's spiritualism relief goal, I get thanked over and over, for simplifying it down to spiritualism and massive ghosts exorcism that goes on for years, LOL.
Everyone loves to hear simply explained the Xenu body-thetans/ghosts exorcism steps and that Tom Cruise had done all his exorcism. Scientology's trying to free earth of a whole lotta messed up ghosts. Ghost-freers, not ghost busters.
yea, so right you are, it's spiritualism quackery, Xenu's ghosts "freeing" is done in such massive quantities, and followers just beaten over their heads to "stay on the Bridge" and get all the exorcism done.
I thought DIY will always be possible, if the whole official movement collapses.
People could dig up on the internet the quackery spiritualism exorcism and DIY but not force it on one another, I wouldn't do that, but it's an options for people into spiritualism.
The splinter Scientologists I don't think force each other. They do the quackery because they think it is of benefit, and they've dispensed with the Hubbard forcing penalty beating their followers over their heads stuff.
Simplying, I today in my daily life, I can dumb Scientology down to spiritualism comparison and "freeing" the ghosts off one's human body, and mention that Tom Cruise has free all his infesting ghosts, and people I explain Scientology thank me, since no one tells them what the durned practice is.
People innately, the ones I run into, know not to get involved with it. I don't warn them so much on the totalitarianism fanaticism, I like to spell out the beliefs, since that's what I wished was in the library when I foolishly joined in 1975, they didn't explain the ghosts exorcism, I wish was out then. I didn't realize Scientology's just a massive high volume spiritualism supposed alleviation practice at the top end, OT 3, 4, 5, 6 and 7 today.
I don't want to see Scientology reformed as you're suggesting. I want to see it eliminated. It's nothing more than a mind controlling and money-making cult. It would be like trying to reform organized crime. Scientology's been described in Wikipedia as a 'religious mafia' which is an accurate description.
I do think "reforming" it is the right direction. That's the intuitive direction of how the splinter Scientologists have gone, over the decades, which is dump all the fanatical excessive Hubbard SP penalties and totalitarian regulations.
Should one never do Scientology, yes, I'd say never do it. Should one quit it, I'd say yes, quit it.
I today, even today, running into people hiking, I define Scientology in 30 seconds. I explain OT 3, 4, 5, 6 and 7 and people thank me for explaining what the media never does focus on, which is the massive science fiction spiritualism activities of Scientology followers. (I wear my "Xenu caused the Wall of Fire" Tshirts all the time, and then I just explain my Tshirt to them.)
Hubbard never dumbed his spiritualism practices down simply, and the followers are incapable and not allowed to dumb Hubbard's science fictionesque spiritualism massive high volume exorcism of Xenu's ghosts that Hubbard teaches is humanity's problem, which to everyday people it's so obvious the Hubbard spiritualism is not what's wrong with earth.
I would stick with steps g) and
i) Shut down.
"a-0) Remove Miscavige. Retire him quietly." Why not send him to the HOLE he created? Wouldn't that be apropos?
Sure, karma, but then, why punish anyone, even those deserving, honestly, if punishment therapy for ex Scientology bad leaders, yea the thought of sending them to their own "holes" they created to punish others, seems tit for tat.
"The Truth Rundown" which I'm glad is a product purchasable and the Anderson Cooper TV shows on the violence at the top of Scientology.
Scientology ought but is incapable of getting Miscavige off the thrown.
After all I've read here and heard on YT, I truly feel Missavage should be dished his own discipline. He doesn't deserve forgiveness for what he's done and continues to do. That's my opinion and I'm sticking to it!
Fair enough.
So Dave couldn’t find any Wal Mart level religious groups to willing to support Masterson and he was able to convince a few dollar store level groups to flex their muscle. I sincerely hope this brief gets exactly the reading it deserves.
If Masterson wasn't financially affluent, would David Miscavige be making any effort to have him released from prison? I'm sure it's all about the money that Masterson would be donating to Scientology if he hadn't been sent to prison. This is why the Church of Scientology is a church in name only and why Scientology is a religion in name only.
I don’t think he cares if Danny gets out. He’s just trying to make Scientology look better. And if releasing a serial rapist helps rehab Scientology he will take it. Yes, even writing this sentence is insane. Miscavige lives that insanity.
There's nothing Miscavige can do to make Scientology look better. It's always had a very bad reputation. When I was involved back in the 80s, I would hear members talking about avoiding bad PR when Scientology had nothing but bad PR. So many members were blind to reality. They bought LRH's propaganda that anyone attacking Scientology is suppressive and doesn't want people to get better.
I was in the GO in the 70s. It doesn’t matter if Scientology’s image can be improved. The entire purpose is to make those still in the bubble still believe it is wonderful.